Discussion:
HotFix error
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t***@antispam.ham
2009-03-15 00:36:50 UTC
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Has anyone seen this error before?

My system hung, so I used C-A-D, and I got the following:

HoTFix: HotFix not allowed during shutdown
08869090

I've never seen a HotFix error message before. What does it
mean?

Since then, within the last day, I've had two Trap 3 crashes, which
I gather involves some breakpoint used in debugging software, but I'm
using kernel 14.103, which I thought wasn't one of the debugging
kernels.

And I burned a couple of audio CDs that, when played, behave very
oddly. I wonder if my system might have developed a hardware problem,
but where?
Trevor Hemsley
2009-03-15 01:29:02 UTC
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Post by t***@antispam.ham
Has anyone seen this error before?
HoTFix: HotFix not allowed during shutdown
08869090
Your hard disk is most likely failing. Hotfix is an HPFS term for allocating a
spare sector to a failed one.

Backup quick.
--
Trevor Hemsley, Brighton, UK
Trevor dot Hemsley at ntlworld dot com
t***@antispam.ham
2009-03-15 02:01:05 UTC
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Post by Trevor Hemsley
Post by t***@antispam.ham
Has anyone seen this error before?
HoTFix: HotFix not allowed during shutdown
08869090
Your hard disk is most likely failing. Hotfix is an HPFS term for allocating a
spare sector to a failed one.
Backup quick.
That's the first thing I did yesterday after the problem surfaced.
Unfortunately, the first attempt at a backup failed due to a Trap 3.
The second attempt succeeded, but another Trap 3 occurred shortly
thereafter.

If it's just bad sectors, would reformatting with /L possibly help?

I've got six drives on this system, but if it's just HPFS that issues
that message, that would narrow down the possibilities, because only
one drive is formatted with HPFS (but with three partitions, one for
the operating system, one for a maintenance partition, and one spare).
Everything else is JFS. On ther other hand, during one of the reboots,
JFS did not complete the CHKDSK on one of the JFS partitions because
of some problem that referenced a file "M", which I don't have. The
problem did not recur during a second reboot. But with various
problems occuring with various drives, I'm wondering whether my SCSI
adapter might be going bad.
Trevor Hemsley
2009-03-15 21:26:53 UTC
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Post by t***@antispam.ham
If it's just bad sectors, would reformatting with /L possibly help?
With modern hard disks, once you get bad sectors being reported back to the
operating system it means that the stash of spares that the disk keeps for
itself is exhausted and then it's just a matter of time before it gets worse.
Disks do remapping in the background without ever telling you that it's happened
thus concealing the damage from you until the last minute.
Post by t***@antispam.ham
I've got six drives on this system, but if it's just HPFS that issues
that message, that would narrow down the possibilities, because only
one drive is formatted with HPFS
[H:\os2\dll]strings uhpfs.dll | grep -i hotfix
HoTFix: HotFix not allowed during ShutDown

[H:\os2\dll]strings ujfs.dll | grep -i hotfix

[H:\os2\dll]

Looks like just HPFS has this error msg.
--
Trevor Hemsley, Brighton, UK
Trevor dot Hemsley at ntlworld dot com
Andi B.
2009-03-15 09:55:25 UTC
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Post by Trevor Hemsley
Post by t***@antispam.ham
Has anyone seen this error before?
HoTFix: HotFix not allowed during shutdown
08869090
Your hard disk is most likely failing. Hotfix is an HPFS term for allocating a
spare sector to a failed one.
Backup quick.
Maybe it's a problem introduced by your ATAPI-SCSI bridge you mentioned in the
other thread. Have you tried if this errors are related to this?

Andi
t***@antispam.ham
2009-03-16 01:28:53 UTC
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Post by Andi B.
Maybe it's a problem introduced by your ATAPI-SCSI bridge you mentioned in the
other thread. Have you tried if this errors are related to this?
I doubt it. I've been running a pure SCSI system for six years.
Peter Brown
2009-03-15 01:35:38 UTC
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Hi tholen
Post by t***@antispam.ham
Has anyone seen this error before?
HoTFix: HotFix not allowed during shutdown
08869090
I've never seen a HotFix error message before. What does it
mean?
I think I have seen that message before - or something very similar -
several years ago. It was delivered by a WindowsMe system that was
rapidly dying from spyware/malware infections.

I'd be surprised if the cause is the same but the below problems look
like the sort of problems that were occurring on that Windows system -
continual crashes, strange results during file copying; not sure if the
customer had burnt any CDs which behaved oddly though.
Post by t***@antispam.ham
Since then, within the last day, I've had two Trap 3 crashes, which
I gather involves some breakpoint used in debugging software, but I'm
using kernel 14.103, which I thought wasn't one of the debugging
kernels.
And I burned a couple of audio CDs that, when played, behave very
oddly. I wonder if my system might have developed a hardware problem,
but where?
While I doubt if your system has a working Windows malware installed and
causing problems I have never seen a HotFix message on OS/2 based
systems and have no idea what could cause it.


As regards crashes and CD burning problems: It might be worth opening
the system case and checking for "dust bunnies". Dust buildup on cooling
surfaces and on fans can cause all sorts of weird problems which at
first glance look like hardware faults.

Might also be worth checking that the PSU is not failing.

Regards

Pete
Lars Erdmann
2009-03-15 10:08:45 UTC
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Hi,
As regards crashes and CD burning problems: It might be worth opening the
system case and checking for "dust bunnies". Dust buildup on cooling
surfaces and on fans can cause all sorts of weird problems which at first
glance look like hardware faults.
Might also be worth checking that the PSU is not failing.
Exactly. The PSU is the problem most of the time, much more often that
Harddrive, CPU or anything else.
I had fatal CHKDSK failures and IBMS506.ADD wildly beeping and installed
OS/2 about 3 times until I finally replaced the PSU from its original 150W
(much too little) to 400W. I have not had any problems since.

The reason: the PSU is the only part a PC manufacturer can save money (with
the problem of a too weak PSU showing up much later due to environmental
wear: temperature, aging ...). And that's what they do. So, invest that
money and get a new one. It's not that expensive.



Lars
Mike Luther
2009-03-15 13:29:39 UTC
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Yes, Lars
Post by Lars Erdmann
Hi,
As regards crashes and CD burning problems: It might be worth opening the
system case and checking for "dust bunnies". Dust buildup on cooling
surfaces and on fans can cause all sorts of weird problems which at first
glance look like hardware faults.
Might also be worth checking that the PSU is not failing.
Exactly. The PSU is the problem most of the time, much more often that
Harddrive, CPU or anything else.
I had fatal CHKDSK failures and IBMS506.ADD wildly beeping and installed
OS/2 about 3 times until I finally replaced the PSU from its original 150W
(much too little) to 400W. I have not had any problems since.
The reason: the PSU is the only part a PC manufacturer can save money (with
the problem of a too weak PSU showing up much later due to environmental
wear: temperature, aging ...). And that's what they do. So, invest that
money and get a new one. It's not that expensive.
Lars
I second your motion. As well note that in general, as a result of the way PSU
design and costing work out, the lower rhe PSU size, compared to the load which
is put on it, the shorter the Mean Time Before Failure (MTBF) life for a given
unit is. What you can do to seriously extend the MTBF for the whole system is
to use a seriously larger PSU for the box. Not unusual to get a somewhat
linear result. Double the size is double the MTBF for a given situation,
regardless of the load-failure relationship, for the long run.


A 150 watt PSU is a horribly small PSU for virtually anything we do these days.
As well anything with more than one drive in it is very much at risk for a
PSU that size.
--
--> Sleep well; OS2's still awake! ;)

Mike Luther
t***@antispam.ham
2009-03-16 01:31:57 UTC
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Post by Lars Erdmann
Exactly. The PSU is the problem most of the time, much more often that
Harddrive, CPU or anything else.
I had fatal CHKDSK failures and IBMS506.ADD wildly beeping and installed
OS/2 about 3 times until I finally replaced the PSU from its original 150W
(much too little) to 400W. I have not had any problems since.
The reason: the PSU is the only part a PC manufacturer can save money (with
the problem of a too weak PSU showing up much later due to environmental
wear: temperature, aging ...). And that's what they do. So, invest that
money and get a new one. It's not that expensive.
My SCSI hard drives are in an external enclosure with a separate power
supply. When I first constructed my system six years ago, I replaced
the internal power supply with a beefier unit so that it wouldn't be
working too close to its capacity.
Christian Hennecke
2009-03-16 23:29:07 UTC
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Post by t***@antispam.ham
Post by Lars Erdmann
Exactly. The PSU is the problem most of the time, much more often that
Harddrive, CPU or anything else.
I had fatal CHKDSK failures and IBMS506.ADD wildly beeping and installed
OS/2 about 3 times until I finally replaced the PSU from its original 150W
(much too little) to 400W. I have not had any problems since.
The reason: the PSU is the only part a PC manufacturer can save money (with
the problem of a too weak PSU showing up much later due to environmental
wear: temperature, aging ...). And that's what they do. So, invest that
money and get a new one. It's not that expensive.
My SCSI hard drives are in an external enclosure with a separate power
supply. When I first constructed my system six years ago, I replaced
the internal power supply with a beefier unit so that it wouldn't be
working too close to its capacity.
6 years is a long time in terms of computer equipment. I've had numerous
bad experiences with ageing capacitors.
--
"I smell blood and an era of prominent madmen." - W.H. Auden
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